{"id":12996,"date":"2013-03-19T13:36:21","date_gmt":"2013-03-19T20:36:21","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/?p=12996"},"modified":"2013-03-20T00:01:13","modified_gmt":"2013-03-20T07:01:13","slug":"thoughts-on-minimum-wages-and-equality","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/thoughts-on-minimum-wages-and-equality\/","title":{"rendered":"Thoughts on minimum wages and equality"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>View 767 Tuesday, March 19, 2013<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-content\/uploads\/2013\/03\/clip_image00240.gif\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" style=\"background-image: none; border-right-width: 0px; margin: 0px; padding-left: 0px; padding-right: 0px; display: inline; border-top-width: 0px; border-bottom-width: 0px; border-left-width: 0px; padding-top: 0px\" title=\"clip_image002\" border=\"0\" alt=\"clip_image002\" src=\"http:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-content\/uploads\/2013\/03\/clip_image002_thumb11.gif\" width=\"240\" height=\"8\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n<p>I have most of my teeth, one of the great benefits of living in this modern age \u2013 when I was young almost no one kept their own teeth beyond the age of 70. Social Security was designed in a time when life expectancy at birth was fairly low due to infant mortality, but if you lived to age 65 you could expect another ten to twelve years if male and a couple of years longer if female; on the other hand, medical care for the elderly didn\u2019t cost so much because there wasn\u2019t a lot anyone could do to keep people going. There was plenty you could do for yourself, but that\u2019s a different story. I see I am rambling again.<\/p>\n<p>I have had a partial upper plate \u2013 what dentists call a flipper \u2013 since for more than fifty years, but a couple of months ago I managed to fall flat on my face on the sidewalk at dusk, and while I was able to catch my fall, sort of, I knocked out a front tooth, so another had to be added to my flipper \u2013 and Monday at lunch the glue or whatever they had used to attach it to gave way. I\u2019m scheduled to do a video interview with Leo Laporte tomorrow at 3, so we scrambled to get to the dentist, resulting in my having an 0800 appointment today. For the last forty years I haven\u2019t undertaken to be either civil or coherent before ten in the morning, but there was nothing for it. Fortunately I live in a village, and my dentist is in the next village so I had no problem.<\/p>\n<p>All of which is a long tale on why I may be even more incoherent then usual today. I should be in form by tomorrow afternoon. No idea what we will talk about.<\/p>\n<p>I am also trying to work up the energy to get back to doing silly things so you don\u2019t have to. In anticipation of that we have built two rather amazing machines, both in handsome Thermaltake cases; one is Windows 7, and one is Windows 8. I am trying very hard to like Windows 8, but I haven\u2019t really managed to make myself do it. Meanwhile it\u2019s time to replace a couple of my aging main systems, but it\u2019s also tax time: I\u2019m not about to change horses in the middle of that stream. There\u2019s still a lot going on out there in computer land and it\u2019s all getting cheaper. The world of publishing has turned upside down \u2013 if you are contemplating getting into my racket writing books, the first thing to understand is that if your work has any legs at all, the eBook rights are likely to be worth a lot more than the print rights, so signing away the electronic rights for an unlimited period may be a terrible idea. I say this because a number of reputable publishing houses have opened new imprints to attract new writers, and the boiler plate language in their contracts is plain horrible. One demands electronic rights \u201cfor the life of the copyright\u201d. Others actually accomplish the same thing without quite saying so.<\/p>\n<p>Be careful out there.<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-content\/uploads\/2013\/03\/clip_image002119.gif\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" style=\"background-image: none; border-right-width: 0px; margin: 0px; padding-left: 0px; padding-right: 0px; display: inline; border-top-width: 0px; border-bottom-width: 0px; border-left-width: 0px; padding-top: 0px\" title=\"clip_image002[1]\" border=\"0\" alt=\"clip_image002[1]\" src=\"http:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-content\/uploads\/2013\/03\/clip_image0021_thumb11.gif\" width=\"240\" height=\"8\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n<p>I don\u2019t do breaking news and I am trying to stay away from narrow political issues, but some issues illustrate political or economic issues of some importance.<\/p>\n<p>In particular, Senator Elizabeth Warren is saying<\/p>\n<blockquote>\n<p>&quot;If we started in 1960 and we said that as productivity goes up, that is as workers are producing more, then the minimum wage is going to go up the same. And if that were the case then the minimum wage today would be about $22 an hour,&quot; <a href=\"http:\/\/www.youtube.com\/watch?feature=player_embedded&amp;v=ABM0_L_5vLw\" class=\"external\" rel=\"nofollow\" target=\"_blank\">she said<\/a>, speaking to Dr. Arindrajit Dube, a University of Massachusetts Amherst professor who has studied the economic impacts of minimum wage. &quot;So my question is Mr. Dube, with a minimum wage of $7.25 an hour, what happened to the other $14.75? It sure didn&#8217;t go to the worker.&quot;<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.huffingtonpost.com\/2013\/03\/18\/elizabeth-warren-minimum-wage_n_2900984.html\" class=\"external\" rel=\"nofollow\" target=\"_blank\">http:\/\/www.huffingtonpost.com\/2013\/03\/18\/elizabeth-warren-minimum-wage_n_2900984.html<\/a><\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<p>I am sure that the prospect of a $22\/hour minimum wage excites a number of voters making considerably less than that. Of course any law that raised the minimum wage to that rate would also have to forbid employers from simply firing workers who don\u2019t produce that much return on investment, which would also require a law forbidding them to go bankrupt; possibly a law requiring the firm\u2019s customers to continue to do business with firms that raised their prices because of the minimum wage law? I realize that seems silly and beyond reason \u2013 but I will remind you that as the Roman Empire began its collapse, one desperate attempt to keep the economy going required that each man follow in the profession of his father; which had considerable effect on the economic collapse. Other desperate measures were attempted, most equally as flawed.<\/p>\n<p>Also in the current news was the attempt by the government of Cyprus to bail out its banks by seizing 5 to 10% of all monies deposited in them (accompanied, of course, by a compulsory freeze on withdrawals from the banks). As I write this the Cyprus parliament has refused to give this power to government, and the government is looking for some other means to prevent the coming collapse of the banks. The government has gotten so far into debt that this radical move seemed like a good idea. I haven\u2019t heard any proposals that the United States follow suit, but we have had compulsory bank holidays to prevent runs on the banks, and there certainly have been proposals to finance the US debt by taxing the savings of \u201cthe rich\u201d including retirement savings. Some of those proposals have been from people usually taken seriously.<\/p>\n<p>The notion of a \u201cfair\u201d wage is central to many socialist views of proper government. They are usually coupled with schemes to rationalize the economy: why should there be twenty brands of tooth paste? It is a wasteful practice. A rationally planned economy would prevent a great deal of effort wasted in competitive practices, thus leaving more to be paid to the workers. After all, the workers produce the goods: they have a right to a fair share, which should at least include a living wage.<\/p>\n<p>The problem is that often a job cannot possibly produce enough return to warrant a \u201cfair\u201d wage. When the production doesn\u2019t at least equal the cost, there isn\u2019t a job to be had. Many \u2018jobs\u2019 are discretionary. You will pay someone to do something so that you don\u2019t have to do it yourself, but if the cost is too high, you will just do it yourself, or go without that service entirely. Clearly there are things I would like to have done for me that I don\u2019t think I can afford. Raising the minimum wage simply moves more jobs from the \u201cI can afford that\u201d to the \u201cCan\u2019t afford it\u201d column. That is, it does in the real world. In Senator Warren\u2019s world, her intentions are what matter: she means well. If her proposal ends up costing a number of people their jobs, that wasn\u2019t her intent, so it doesn\u2019t matter: we\u2019ll just give them more benefits to make up for their loss.<\/p>\n<p>I wish that were a parody, but it is not.<\/p>\n<p>Milton Friedman once said that every economist knows that minimum wages either have no effect or create unemployment, and that this was not an observation, it was a definition. It should also be self evident.<\/p>\n<p>The Huffington Post article on Senator Warren\u2019s views on minimum wage went on to say<\/p>\n<blockquote>\n<p>It didn&#8217;t appear that Warren was actually trying to make the case for a $22 an hour minimum wage, but rather highlighting the <a href=\"http:\/\/www.huffingtonpost.com\/2013\/02\/13\/minimum-wage-productivity_n_2680639.html?ncid=edlinkusaolp00000003\" class=\"external\" rel=\"nofollow\" target=\"_blank\">results of a recent study<\/a> that showed flat minimum wage growth over the past 40-plus years coinciding with surging inequality across a number of economic indicators.<\/p>\n<p>Warren went on to argue that raising the federal minimum wage to over $10 an hour in incremental steps over the next two years &#8212; a cause championed by President Barack Obama in his State of the Union address and <a href=\"http:\/\/beta.congress.gov\/bill\/113th-congress\/senate-bill\/460\/text?q=s%20460\" class=\"external\" rel=\"nofollow\" target=\"_blank\">since taken up in the Senate<\/a> &#8212; would <a href=\"http:\/\/www.huffingtonpost.com\/2013\/02\/22\/minimum-wage-benefits_n_2689246.html\" class=\"external\" rel=\"nofollow\" target=\"_blank\">not be as damaging<\/a> for businesses as some critics have argued.<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<p>I have not seen any rational argument for $10\/hour as opposed to $22\/hour other than the obvious statement that $10\/hour doesn\u2019t do as much harm as $22\/hour would. But if the notion is a fair wage is a living wage, why not determine just what is \u201cneeded\u201d by the worker and set the wage to that?<\/p>\n<p>If the goal is to reduce inequality, then we should discuss ways to reduce inequality, including \u201cdisributist\u201d schemes in which confiscated property is divided and given out equally to all, or by a lottery, or perhaps to those \u201cdeserving\u201d more (to be determined by appointed or elected boards of equalization); but that does not seem to be what is proposed. Yet.<\/p>\n<p>It\u2019s lunch time, and I need to get back to the taxes.<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-content\/uploads\/2013\/03\/clip_image002213.gif\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" style=\"background-image: none; border-right-width: 0px; margin: 0px; padding-left: 0px; padding-right: 0px; display: inline; border-top-width: 0px; border-bottom-width: 0px; border-left-width: 0px; padding-top: 0px\" title=\"clip_image002[2]\" border=\"0\" alt=\"clip_image002[2]\" src=\"http:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-content\/uploads\/2013\/03\/clip_image0022_thumb10.gif\" width=\"240\" height=\"8\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n<p>&#160;<\/p>\n<blockquote>\n<p>So my question is Mr. Dube, with a minimum wage of $7.25 an hour, what happened to the other $14.75? It sure didn\u2019t go to the worker<\/p>\n<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;<\/p>\n<p>My answer? It went for taxes, compliance with regulation, paying bunny inspectors and keeping obsolete military bases open. It went to Red China to service debt.<\/p>\n<p>Ad nauseum?<\/p>\n<p>B<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<p>&#160;<\/p>\n<p>&#160;<\/p>\n<blockquote>\n<p>&#160;<\/p>\n<p>Jerry,<\/p>\n<p>Most of the &quot;missing&quot; $14.75 of that productivity-adjusted $22 an hour has gone into lower prices, of course. All manner of things cost far less in constant dollars these days than in 1960, due precisely to those vast improvements in productivity. And this cornucopia of cheap goods benefit most &#8211; wait for it &#8211; the people making $7.25 an hour. Most of whom Warren&#8217;s prescription would both put out of work and price out of much of the modest lifestyle they currently can afford.<\/p>\n<p>Porkypine<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<p>We can all come up with places where the money went. The planned economy can always absorb more; there is never a shortage of people in need. Longer discussion in an upcoming mailbag.<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-content\/uploads\/2013\/03\/clip_image002310.gif\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" style=\"background-image: none; border-right-width: 0px; margin: 0px; padding-left: 0px; padding-right: 0px; display: inline; border-top-width: 0px; border-bottom-width: 0px; border-left-width: 0px; padding-top: 0px\" title=\"clip_image002[3]\" border=\"0\" alt=\"clip_image002[3]\" src=\"http:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-content\/uploads\/2013\/03\/clip_image0023_thumb9.gif\" width=\"240\" height=\"8\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n<blockquote>\n<p>\u201cThe president looks more and more like a king that the Constitution was designed to replace.\u201d <\/p>\n<p>&lt;<a href=\"http:\/\/www.mcclatchydc.com\/2013\/03\/19\/186309\/obama-turning-to-executive-power.html\" class=\"external\" rel=\"nofollow\" target=\"_blank\">http:\/\/www.mcclatchydc.com\/2013\/03\/19\/186309\/obama-turning-to-executive-power.html<\/a>&gt;<\/p>\n<p>Roland Dobbins<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<p>The advantage of monarchy is that often the King is able to study his job rather than spend his life learning how to get the job.&#160; Of course heredity isn\u2019t terribly reliable, so over time we learned to limit the power of kings. Empire doesn\u2019t need kings, and in fact introducing nepotism into imperial selection of officers and advisors usually produces terrible results even form a good emperor; Marcus Aurelius demonstrated that quite well. <\/p>\n<p>It does appear that Mr. Obama favors the liberal interpretation of events: that he should be judged by his intentions not for prudentially predictable results.&#160; <\/p>\n<p>&#160;<\/p>\n<p>&#160;<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-content\/uploads\/2013\/03\/clip_image00247.gif\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" style=\"background-image: none; border-right-width: 0px; margin: 0px; padding-left: 0px; padding-right: 0px; display: inline; border-top-width: 0px; border-bottom-width: 0px; border-left-width: 0px; padding-top: 0px\" title=\"clip_image002[4]\" border=\"0\" alt=\"clip_image002[4]\" src=\"http:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-content\/uploads\/2013\/03\/clip_image0024_thumb7.gif\" width=\"240\" height=\"8\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-content\/uploads\/2013\/03\/clip_image00257.gif\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" style=\"background-image: none; border-right-width: 0px; margin: 0px; padding-left: 0px; padding-right: 0px; display: inline; border-top-width: 0px; border-bottom-width: 0px; border-left-width: 0px; padding-top: 0px\" title=\"clip_image002[5]\" border=\"0\" alt=\"clip_image002[5]\" src=\"http:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-content\/uploads\/2013\/03\/clip_image0025_thumb6.gif\" width=\"240\" height=\"8\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-content\/uploads\/2013\/03\/clip_image00265.gif\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" style=\"background-image: none; border-right-width: 0px; margin: 0px; padding-left: 0px; padding-right: 0px; display: inline; border-top-width: 0px; border-bottom-width: 0px; border-left-width: 0px; padding-top: 0px\" title=\"clip_image002[6]\" border=\"0\" alt=\"clip_image002[6]\" src=\"http:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-content\/uploads\/2013\/03\/clip_image0026_thumb5.gif\" width=\"240\" height=\"8\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-content\/uploads\/2013\/03\/clip_image0041.jpg\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" style=\"background-image: none; border-right-width: 0px; margin: 0px; padding-left: 0px; padding-right: 0px; display: inline; border-top-width: 0px; border-bottom-width: 0px; border-left-width: 0px; padding-top: 0px\" title=\"clip_image004\" border=\"0\" alt=\"clip_image004\" src=\"http:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-content\/uploads\/2013\/03\/clip_image004_thumb1.jpg\" width=\"244\" height=\"6\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n<p><a href=\"http:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-content\/uploads\/2013\/03\/clip_image00275.gif\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" style=\"background-image: none; border-right-width: 0px; padding-left: 0px; padding-right: 0px; display: inline; border-top-width: 0px; border-bottom-width: 0px; border-left-width: 0px; padding-top: 0px\" title=\"clip_image002[7]\" border=\"0\" alt=\"clip_image002[7]\" src=\"http:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-content\/uploads\/2013\/03\/clip_image0027_thumb5.gif\" width=\"240\" height=\"8\" \/><\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>View 767 Tuesday, March 19, 2013 I have most of my teeth, one of the great benefits of living in this modern age \u2013 when I was young almost no one kept their own teeth beyond the age of 70. Social Security was designed in a time when life expectancy \u2026 <a class=\"continue-reading-link\" href=\"https:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/thoughts-on-minimum-wages-and-equality\/\"> Continue reading <span class=\"meta-nav\">&rarr; <\/span><\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[5],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-12996","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-view"],"post_mailing_queue_ids":[],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/12996","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=12996"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/12996\/revisions"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=12996"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=12996"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.jerrypournelle.com\/chaosmanor\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=12996"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}